Episode #19: From ad agency to entrepreneur…how and when? with Eurah Lee
In this episode, Julia talks with Eurah Lee, a fellow agency girl who also jumped ship and joined the creative gig economy as an entrepreneur. They talk about the value of internships and mentors, the difference between the DC and NYC agency environments, and how and when they made the move from agency to entrepreneurs. If you’re contemplating your next career move, join them in a lively discussion.
From ad agency to entrepreneur…how and when? with Eurah Lee Episode Recap
Eurah Lee, a creative professional, shares her experiences in the advertising industry and her journey from college to agency work. She reflects on the challenges and rewards of working in this fast-paced field and discusses her decision to move to New York in pursuit of her dreams. However, her expectations of the city were not entirely met, and she now contemplates a move to the Pacific Northwest, considering it as a potential next step.
During her time in the creative world, Eurah has gained valuable insights into the entire production process, from understanding client challenges to handling post-production. This knowledge has been instrumental in her current work, allowing her to grasp the essence of a project and deliver effective solutions. Moreover, her experience in interviewing people during her broadcast journalism days has honed her skills in comprehending clients’ needs and helping them articulate their goals effectively.
Following a career transition and a time of uncertainty, Eurah decided to embark on a new venture with her best friend, establishing their social media agency, Kami. Having a supportive partner enabled her to take this step with confidence, and they transformed their initial idea of starting a virtual assistant company into a thriving social media agency.
Eurah’s perspective on the freelancing lifestyle is encouraging and emphasizes the importance of seizing opportunities. If someone is contemplating freelancing or starting their own business, she believes they should take the leap and trust that the right path will unfold before them. She also advises shedding limiting beliefs or situations to make room for new possibilities and growth.
Throughout the conversation, Eurah and Julia share a sense of camaraderie and mutual support. They celebrate the power of collaborating with like-minded individuals in the creative community and acknowledge the importance of lifting each other up. Their experiences demonstrate that success can come from taking bold steps, believing in oneself, and embracing the ever-evolving landscape of the creative industry.
Episode Transcript:
Julia McDowell
Welcome to the Two Marketing Moms Podcast. Today I have a very special guest. Eurah Lee, and her company is KaMi Social Media Agency. And just let me tell you a little about her before we get into it. She is an award-winning producer, and co-founder of her agency. Throughout her career, she’s worked with ad agencies and production companies, creating videos and digital campaigns for a variety of brands like NARS, American Foundation for Suicide Prevention, and Etat Libre d’Orange. She worked her way up from a production assistant to producer in two restless years, which we will talk about, and whether she is producing commercials animated videos, or digital ads her concepts always revolve around one question, how can we make the viewer feel something? She believes social and commercial content should be designed to inspire engagement with one another. And lastly, she has always followed one supreme rule throughout her career. The seven P’s of production (which I also love) prior proper planning prevents piss poor production, from Rosemary Reed, her first boss.
So I feel like you and I were destined to meet? We found each other through the freelancing females group on Facebook, which honestly is like, this amazing group of women that are there to support each other. It’s just like, really such a magical group. So you pitched me I like loved your pitch deck. I was like this girl like they you and your partner? You got it. So that when we met, we realize we grew up in the same town. And we actually went to the same high school, even though you went there nearly 20 years after me just a few years apart? It’s also very cool that you started your career at Double R in DC, where I’m located, and then you moved to NYC to get the experience in one of the, if not biggest, advertising hubs in the world. So, let’s start from the beginning, even though I have so many questions for you.
Okay, I noticed you had like the most amazing intern experience. And I like this is one of the things we haven’t talked about too much on the podcast, but it’s so important, because I also did too. Talk about internships, like, how did you seek those out? Like, what impact did they have? Let’s start there.
Eurah Lee
Okay, first of all, I just want to start off with saying that mentorship is so freaking important. Like, whether it is a high school mentor, or wherever you can find guidance. I really think that that is where I got my first start. And I had a really great mentor when I was in high school. I was a really bad high school student. I got expelled from High School. Can I tell you why–I had weed in my car. And I got expelled. Yeah. So I luckily had a very great mentor at the time, who knew that I had potential even though I was going through this rebellious phase, and he kind of guided me all the way throughout half of my college career, too. So when I got into college, when I got to VCU, my mentor really made sure that I knew meeting my professors on the very first day of school…sitting on the first row of the big lecture classes, introducing myself afterwards like even though they seem very, like, you know, I’m class pet-ish. It really boosted my mentality to who I want to become and who I want to be seen as. And I noticed that by doing things like those little things, introducing yourself having confidence as a student. It really helped shape my career, because then I felt confident enough to go out and network. So I think I learned at an early age that networking was like, honestly, the number one thing to getting a job to excel in your career. And when I was in college, I was studying broadcast journalism. I thought that I wanted to be a news reporter, and I went into that and it was like, this is just sad stories and heartbreak and I was like, I’m not about that, like, I don’t want to live in a depressed state of mind and always have to chase stories like I was like, I’m too lazy for that.
One time I was doing like a package story on an environmental group at my school and I went with them to this workshop at William and Mary. There they had this big music, hip hop producer, come and speak. And his name was Maleek Yousef, and he actually started out with Kanye West, like back in Chicago. And I, it was so crazy, because before he got up on stage to speak, he was like getting off of a phone call. And he was like, I’m sorry. Does anyone here know Korean? Because I’m talking to a Korean person, I need some help. And I’m Korean. So I just immediately raiseed my hand and he was like, Okay, can you come talk to me after the speech? And I was like, okay, and there’s like, hundreds of students around. Yeah, it was so weird. And so afterwards, I like made my way over to him. And I helped him like, translate this phone call. And afterwards, he was like, you know, I really like you. You’re really smart. Like, do you want an internship with me? And I was like, What the hell? Like, are you serious? So I followed up, and I kept pushing, because like my mentor had, you know, shaped me to keep pushing and be aggressive.
So, then I got the internship in LA and actually turned into one of the worst and best internships of my life. It was in the LA and Hollywood and music industry, entertainment fashion, I was just thrown into that as like a naïve college person. And this world, this industry is exactly what it seems like on TV. And I don’t want anything to do with this. So that’s kind of like, how I got my foot into the internship world.
But although it was like one of the most, I guess, like eye opening internship experiences for me, like seeing what this Hollywood life is really like, but also being thrown into like, producing, like, clothes, like I was helping them with a fashion shoot and like booking fashion, you know, shows in New York and LA like as a 18. I was 20. I was 20 years old, like dealing with $50,000 budgets, and I had no idea what I was doing. But I think I learned to Just do it. Literally just, they taught you the hustle. It taught me the hustle. And from then I just kept I had the confidence when I came back. And I was like, I could do you know, whatever I want. So yeah, I just was dragged through the Hollywood mud and came back to DC finish school. And then you know, got a job. And I knew from that I was like; I don’t ever want to work in LA again.
Julia McDowell
Well, the thing is, people like don’t think about this. They don’t think about internships in this way. It’s supposed to teach you also what you don’t want to do. It’s like a little experiment, which is so perfect. Who wants to truly experiment once they’ve graduated college? I mean, you can, it’s just the stakes are higher. I was always going after internships in a very narrow lane. Like, this is what I want to do. I almost feel like oh, what if I had just done something different? And learned what I didn’t want to do? Yeah, that is just as valuable.
Eurah Lee
I think everyone thinks of internships as like, if you had a bad internship, like, Oh, that was a bad experience. And it’s like, well, what did you learn from it? What do you never want to do something like that again? And now you have like a better outlook on your road ahead. My high school mentor told me this one phrase that I will never forget. And he was like, sometimes in life, we go through speed bumps, and speed bumps, they help you slow down, but they also help you prepare for the for the road ahead.
Julia McDowell
Let’s just jump into the more like present day things like some of the, like, we we discussed so many fascinating things a few weeks ago. So when I was at GW for college, I interviewed with Ogilvy New York, and I was thinking, Oh, I got to go to New York, because that’s where advertising is. And had an interview. I didn’t get the job. But I started to really think about: What does moving to New York mean? And how would that be different for me? And I had an internship, a great internship here that, like I loved and I was like I’m gonna stay here. But I feel like so many people are wrestling with this same thing. Like, what’s the difference between the two markets? What do you like about DC? What made you want to move to NYC? I feel like this is something that a lot of people have on their minds.
Eurah Lee
DC, I think is the perfect start for any career. It’s a smaller market for sure. So like, whatever industry, you’re going into, whether it’s like marketing, or I don’t know, cybersecurity, I don’t know what else there is. It’s kind of like you are the expert in that field, right. And everyone else around you in the DC market will trust you. Because you’re the expert. They don’t pretend to know what you know. But I think the biggest difference is when you get to New York, everyone thinks they know everything about marketing, or video production or cyber security. It’s like, you hired us, because we’re the experts, you hired us because you trust us, please just trust us. So, I missed that about DC, like I miss people being able to be like, “You’re hired, do your thing.” And in New York, like the clients, of course, you get paid more, and the budgets are much higher, the stakes are higher, the production value was greater.
It’s a lot more fun. I don’t want to say freedom, you don’t have more freedom in the actual content itself, but you have more freedom to hire, you know, a Jaguar if you want. But it’s just people in New York think that they can do your job for you, “I know marketing too, you know, I my son’s own marketing agency, and well, blah. So I know that this video should be six minutes long.” It’s like, Why? Why should it be six minutes long? You hired us for a reason.
I guess the main thing about the difference between DC and New York is obviously, the pay gap as well. I think when I immediately as I got to New York, my salary doubled, and I had the same experience. It was like just within like a month of moving there. But the term more money more problems is very true. Very, very true. And although I was making more, I had a lot more stress. I had no freedom in the projects that I wanted to work in. I had no freedom in my life. Honestly,
I was working all the time. And I think that’s also another thing about New York is that there is no separation from your identity to your career. You are your career. And that is like New York rules like we come here to hustle like hustle culture is alive and well over here. Yeah. And that’s what breaks a lot of people down and a lot of people get really depressed because their entire life revolves around their career. And it wasn’t until I got let go from my job that I was able to separate from that, that I realized, wait, who am I without my career? Who am I without my title? I actually still have amazing experience! I still have all these skills and blah, blah, blah. I don’t need to live my life under this. This agency that I work for Um, I think that’s, that’s something that a lot of people struggle with, I’m sure.
And you had something similar? I mean, like, when you were working at your past place to it just kind of it took you a long time, and you realize that the mission wasn’t the same.
Julia McDowell
I mean, I’m not really a risk taker, you know. And so yeah, I wrestled with, what should I do? I had one vision for how I wanted to work and the type of agency I wanted to create in terms of culture and the type of people I wanted to hire. Maybe the type of work I wanted to do, maybe even like, the way I wanted to accomplish the work. And it was, like, diverting, so far from where I was that, eventually, I had no choice, but to actually take the risk, decide to go out on my own. And, and all those experiences, you know, over that long period of time, which was far too long, did give me the confidence to do it. And it was it was a tough, it was a tough decision to make, obviously. But in the long term, it was really positive. So do you feel like going to New York was a good move? Yes.
Eurah Lee
Yes. For sure. I don’t regret it one bit. I think that I had to take this step, too. Well, let me first start by saying I think if I would have stayed in DC, you know, the creative field in DC is pretty small. Yep. everybody kind of knows each other. Yep. Everyone fights for the same projects.
Julia McDowell
Yes. Because the big work. Yeah. Is not plentiful. And so if you’re in the inner circle of DC, of agencies, you’re gonna know what other three agencies are pitching this work. It’s good and bad, right. Like, you know, your competitive edge or your where you’re gonna fall short. Your pricing? Yeah. I’m sure it’s not that way in New York…
Eurah Lee
I mean, of course, New York has their top agencies as well, Grey, Ogilvy, you know, other places that mainly get the really big projects, but there’s still plenty of work to go around. And I think in DC, that’s not the case. But then moving to New York, I worked on so many different brands, fashion, like makeup, cars, and it was a lot of fun. But I also feel like and this goes back to what I was saying before, there’s a little bit less of creative freedom.
Julia McDowell
Yeah. Mo Money Mo Problems? Yeah, sure. Wait, so do you think that if you had gone straight to New York with ever without having that foundation in DC, like, what’s your advice to that person? Like, I feel like I feel like it could go either way, right? Kelly, my co host, she went straight into Grey and had the most amazing experiences. But I definitely am much more of a you person was like, let’s get that foundation in an environment that’s not such a pressure cooker. Where you can take a little more time to learn things. And then go to that next step. So I don’t know. What’s your advice on that one? I would say start small.
Eurah Lee
Yeah, like do what we did. Yeah, if you can stay like after you graduate from school, especially like when it comes to savings, the only reason that I got let go from my recent job and was able to take a month off and then start this company was because I had savings. And I don’t think that would have been possible if I didn’t stay at home, after I graduated from school for like a year and work at double R and make some money and start, you know, getting some savings. And that set me up. That literally set me up for like the next five years. So I think that and also, if you start small, you get to put your hands in so many different things to like, if you started a smaller company, if you start in a smaller network like DC, you can work as like a production assistant, then work up to production coordinator, like quickly. But if you’re over at one of those bigger places, you work in a silo you’re just like doing this one little thing. And everyone’s doing this one little thing. And I don’t think you get to learn as much as you could, if you were working for a smaller company.
Julia McDowell
Good advice. Yeah. So are you ready for another move? Yes.
Eurah Lee
And I will always even tell someone if they’re ever thinking about moving to New York, I would literally be like, Why? Why do you want to go there?
Julia McDowell
So you become a jaded New Yorker now? Yes.
Eurah Lee
I’m like, Why do people like this place? Like, I get it. Because I was totally that that girl that was like, I’m a city girl. I’m a small town girl, big dreams, go to New York, get a big paying job, be the world’s best producer ever that lived. But, and then you come here and you’re like, It’s so dirty. And there’s so many people. And I swear you’ll become more lazy than ever before. Because you don’t want to deal with those people. You don’t want to deal with that stuff. Especially if you’re working at a high paced job. Like you just want to go home and relax afterwards. So New York, I think it’s good to maybe get a year here or if you want to jump that salary come to New York and do something. But I think that this city does a lot to your sanity as well. Yeah, even my anxiety, has gone up. And I just am ready for something new. So I think that Seattle or the Pacific Northwest would really be the next move for me. And have you heard that the Pacific Northwest is such a millennial move. Have you ever heard of that?
Julia McDowell
No. My sister moved there. I see it on the internet all the time, like Millennials are moving to the Pacific Northwest. All right, so let’s talk about your roots in production. I feel like this is a nice part of advertising work. As you were saying, if you went to go work in New York, like and you were in accounts, you probably would never get any of your hands in any type of production? And I think it’s like a really cool thing to know. It’s like, knowing where your food comes from, it’s understanding the whole creative process from the first time a client comes in, has an has a has a problem or a challenge to solve. And then, you know, how do you get to that creative brief and that concept, and then production and post and all that stuff? So my question for you is, how does knowing production help you in your work now? Maybe your non production work now?
Eurah Lee
Well, exactly what you said that, you know, as a producer, and even starting as a production assistant, you see every step of the way from concept to completion, literally, how was this video made, and people don’t think about, the crew, you know, people also don’t think about the talent, people don’t think about the location or even like the food for the crew. So, I really got to see that everything is done step by step. And another thing that we talked about this last time is that we can’t do this stuff alone. I mean, there’s only so much that we can do by ourselves. And it really takes a team of trusted individuals who are experts in that certain thing to get this to get this video done to get this concept done, whatever it is, so I’m gonna hire the best audio guy I know, and let him do his job, like you do your job. Because I don’t, I don’t know that. And that goes the same for the designer, whoever the talent like everyone has their place in this in this production. And we all have, we’re all synchronized in making this one thing come to life. I think another thing that has helped me in the production world, with the work that I’m doing now, his interview skills, like interviewing people and talking to strangers, like when I was in broadcast journalism, you literally had to just ask people on the street random things and really get that answer out of them that you want to get. So when it comes to talking to new clients, or talking to current clients, and they have like problems, sometimes like, and I’m sure you deal with this, too, people come to you and they say, I have a problem. But I don’t really know what the problem is. I don’t know exactly how I want to do this. And they’re just so like, vague. So we have to consistently ask questions, questions, questions, and like, literally dig deep down into their brains into their, like souls and hearts and like, figure it out for them, literally figure it out for them.
Julia McDowell
It’s not true.
Eurah Lee
That’s like, what we’re getting paid for is like, our clients don’t know what they want. So we just have to figure it out for them. And the interview skills has helped me to dig deep into what it is they actually want, what it is their actual missing mission and message is, and then you know, step by step using my production skills, make sure that that concept turns into like a tangible or like a, a content that they want.
Julia McDowell
And you can now sell anything. Almost right? When you get the window into how all the pieces work together, you can more easily sell it. Because you know it inside.
Eurah Lee
Yeah, sales is also a huge thing. I think that that was one of the first things that my boss, my old boss, Rosemary told us is, we had a small team, it was like six people. And you know, one was an editor, one was a production coordinator. I was the producer. We have, interns, whatever. She told everyone, every single person on this team is in sales, every staff person, and I took that, like, so. You know, fearless. I mean, like, I really made sure that like sales was such a big boost for everywhere I went. When I went to my next job at Kworq here in New York, the first thing I said was I’m not scared of sales. I’m not scared of networking. I’m not scared to be out there and represent. That was one of the biggest things that they were like, okay, like she’s about it.
Julia McDowell
Yeah, yeah. Hire her. Yeah. We don’t need a biz dev team. Well, you know, in DC, where the agencies are smaller, you know, people wear more hats. So it’s easier to forget that there are people in the agency world that have their strengths. And we need the power of the collective to create that. On the other hand, it’s great because you get your hands and things like, I was just an account manager, but because we had such a small team, I got to be involved in every step of the production. And it was like literally stepping into a world that I never even imagined about, you know, but it was so helpful to to see how the sausage is made, I guess you can say.
Alright, because I feel like you and I have been asked if we haven’t connected on everything else. I want to talk about your decision to go out on your own because I love this topic because we are living in the gig economy. We are living in a time, like no other that people can go out and more easily chase their dreams and work for themselves and create that value and sell themselves. Be that hustler. There’s so many opportunities. I’m personally so grateful for it. And you and I have both done this. So it’s like another thing we have in common.
I was thinking about this, I don’t like to be called a freelancer. It is a title that I own. I work for myself, I don’t belong to–I’m not owned by someone necessarily. So I’m working solo, so I could be an entrepreneur. I also like being called an agency; probably you feel the same. Since I bring in collaborators on almost every engagement that I have. I like being called an entrepreneur.
So talk to me about the factors that led you to creating Kami because I feel again, like this is such a subject that people are wrestling with, like, should I stay? Or should I go? Should I dip my toe out there? Like, how do you do it? Talk about your thought process? And like how that happened?
Eurah Lee
Throughout my career, I’ve had many people, you know, boyfriend, colleagues, bosses always say, you know, one day you’re going to own your own business, or like, why don’t you go out and like, start something on your own, I think you could really do it. And I Oh, I never had full confidence in myself, I would always see my previous bosses struggle with sales struggle with finding new clients, and that shit scared me. I was like, I do not want to lose sleep at night.
Julia McDowell
It still scares me.
Eurah Lee
To me that is the scariest thing to maintain revenue and pay people. So that was honestly my biggest, like setback was that I didn’t want to constantly chase new clients. So when I was let go from my last agency back in September 2020, I basically went through the seven stages of grief and was like my life is over. And what was all this for? Blah, blah, blah. In the middle of a pandemic?
So I went through all that stuff. And I also knew that like, that’s when it hit me that I was actually very depressed that my job, all the stuff that I was working on, I did not feel connected to, and I was kind of thankful, but also, you know, still thinking, what is my life? Where is it going? Now? Luckily, I had my best friend, she was, you know, searching for a job in the middle of a pandemic as well. She had lost her job in the HR field of like this big law firm in DC. And so she was thinking, have you heard of, like, virtual assistants companies? Yeah. So she was like, yeah, there’s so many virtual assistants everywhere. And so she wanted to start one of those and do that. And so it was like, Oh, let me help you. Like, I have some time now. And maybe, you know, when you like, make your own website, you can add me on there as like a marketing consultant, and I can help you.
And this whole time, she was like, scheming to get me on board with her to start it with her. But she knew, but she knew that like, she had to give me some time to like, grieve my job and whatever. Yeah, so she like gave me some time. And then I think like a month, I had a month of like, rest and relaxation, whatever and like thoughts. And after a month, I was like, you know, what, do you want to do this together? Like, let’s start this business together. But like you say that you don’t like being called a freelancer. I don’t want to be called a virtual assistant. Like, I am not a virtual assistant. I am. Yeah, more than that. So I was like, let’s turn this into like a marketing agency. Let’s turn this into something that like we can actually make good money on. So we formed it into a social media agency. And honestly, the only reason I would have start that I was able to start this business was I had a partner, my best friend. Who was able to say we can do this together? Literally, we can do this together. Let’s take it snow. Let’s take it slow. And what do you have to lose? You have no job right now what do you have to lose? Let’s do this. And so because I was at the time, very frustrated with like other agencies and working for someone else and being let go, and like, I was very, like, screw corporate screw capitalism. So yeah, I was like, super, you know, like, fired up from it. So I was like, yeah, let’s start this thing. So I think that being like, go for my job really gave me the push, and also having someone to like, hold hands with and think let’s do this together really, really, like, saved me.
Julia McDowell
Yeah, I was talking to this agency. He’s kind of like a coach, a business coach for people in the agency world. And he was like, I was telling him about, like, you know, growth, and you know, how to get to the next step. And he’s like, you know a lot of people bring in partners, because it is so empowering to just know that you have someone who has your back, someone who’s going to be there when you’re down on who then you know, vice versa, when they’re down. You can be the one to support. You’ll figure it out. I think that’s huge.
Eurah Lee
Yeah. Do you know there’s this other podcast called the future with Chris Joe, he’s like this asian guy. He’s a great graphic Designer. And he has a podcast. I’ll send it to you afterwards. You and yeah, the future. And he talks about, you know, all different types of subjects, you know, going freelance and whatever. He talked to this one guy, I forget his name, but his name is Jason something I believe. And he is an agency owner for like, a huge agency that is in LA San Francisco, I think Seattle, and also in New York. And he was talking about his experience. How he started his agency and like, what are like the downfalls and all this stuff. And he said, honestly, he first started his agency by himself. And after two years, he completely burned out. And he, he ended it, he ended his agency, he couldn’t do anymore. He loved it. But he like literally worked himself to death that he had to just close his agency. And then he was able to find three other partners. So the four of them, and then they opened up a bigger agency. And from them, that is the one agency with the four partners that has grown so much to four different cars. I mean, four different cities. Wow, get tons of projects, and they’re loving it because they’re able to like, work on it together. So he was like, doing it on my own was just, you know, way too rough. Huh?
Julia McDowell
You got me thinking now? Because you do everything on your own, don’t you? I mean, yeah, I have. I have collaborators that that, you know, copywriters, creative people designer, you know, whatever I need. Um, but yeah, it’s, it’s lonely. It’s lonely.
Julia McDowell
you know what, like, we asked when we have like the couple of guests we’ve had on the podcast, like the ones that have been moms will ask: how does being a mom make you better in business? And one of my answers is when you’re a mom, you just power through stuff now. Like, that’s one thing, like I have looked burnout in the face. So many times in the past like 12 months, and then I’m just like, okay, like sleep it off, get up the next morning. Keep going, you know, and like, I don’t think I would have done that pre kids. There was something about becoming a mom and having that responsibility and not being able to like… I was breastfeeding my kids. There was no other person that could substitute for me. It just turned me into this person that I just keep going. So I think whenever I do get really exhausted and stuff, I just go back to that like, “Nope, just keep going, get a good night’s rest. Come back mentally fresh and and just keep going.” We could probably have a whole episode about that.
Eurah Lee
Yeah, no. I mean, I think that honestly, you probably work way harder than I do because you think that like, because you’re trained as a mom, like trained with kids that you think if you come to like a fork in the road, you’re like, Okay, I could either take like a 20 minute nap, or I can like bust this thing out. You don’t even think about those options, maybe because you’re just like, I’m just gonna go ahead and bust this thing out.
Julia McDowell
I think every life stage will bring you to a new version of yourself, right? Like, you and I both have that in common, that college experience. We both found our confidence there and, and learned things that got us to the next level and then in our careers. Also confidence to the next level, because let’s be honest, like, most people we know in the creative industry are not going to go out and work for themselves. Like they are not interested in feeding the beast. Yeah, they want to just do the work. And there is nothing wrong with that. People like you and I just have that. We’re just built that way.
Eurah Lee
Yeah, there is nothing there is nothing wrong with people working a nine to five I am, you know, sometimes I may like throw some shade at them. But I always have to catch myself because I’m like, that was you. And like, there’s no hate in the game. You know, everyone is on their own path. And also, have you heard this one experiment? I can’t remember which book it was from, but it was an experiment on it was an experiment on chickens. And like, chickens having eggs, right? So like, there’s all these, they they have like the really rowdy chickens. And then they have like the chickens who do their job and just like lay the eggs, right? They have the crazy chickens. I like want to lay more eggs and like lay as many eggs, right? So they did this experiment where they put all the let’s call them the nine to five chicken heads in one coop, right. And they just did their job. None of them died. They just did their job and just like laid the eggs. Then they put all the rowdy chicken heads, although aggressive ones, all the smart ones in another coop, and they all died. So the moral of the story is that basically you when you own a business or own an agency, you got to have both chickens. Yes, you hire all the crazy rowdy chickens, the agency will die because they’re all crazy. And they were so true.
Julia McDowell
But it’s so true nine to five chickens. So okay, so when I get to a Friday on a 5pm or like last Friday, for instance, I was definitely the rowdy chicken that was going to like literally put myself in my own grave. And I was like, Okay, you got to shut off. So that Monday you can come back and be the not so crazy chicken. Yeah, yeah, we have to pull ourselves back sometimes. Yeah, I know. It’s so true. Okay, so tell me about like, since you’ve started Kami what has been your biggest win and your biggest fail?
Eurah Lee
My biggest win honestly was just starting starting the business. That that was yes, you go girl. Yeah. And and like, obviously getting new clients is always a win. But just starting was Yeah, just do it. Biggest fail. You know, I was thinking about this. And I feel very fortunate that we haven’t had any big fails just yet. But I would say our biggest fail is that my partner and I are best friends. So it is a blessing and curse that we live in different cities. So she is in DC and I’m in New York. But I’m…
Julia McDowell
Gonna have fun along the way.
Eurah Lee
Yeah, you have to. And it’s a blessing that we are best friends and we have such crazy hilarious humors that we can get through things together by laughing and just having fun, you know, every day, we think, what what are we doing? like, Yo, what are we doing, but let’s just do it. Let’s just see where it goes.
Julia McDowell
Well, there you go, like as a perfect like juxtaposition to mentors, which are so important. It’s also so important to find those kindred spirits that you can not only be friends with, but you can work with that you have like this sometimes like magical synergy, like where you’re thinking the same thing as each other. And each person brings that puzzle piece to, to make it together like yes, that is also so important. I think a lot of people, maybe not recent grads, but there was probably a day where graduates came into the working work and it was like, every person for themselves. Like, we don’t need to form bonds or have relationships or whatever. I’m just gonna be all about me. No, don’t do that.
Eurah Lee
I totally agree. And I think I was so surprised that like, how supportive this small business community is just, everyone’s so supportive. Look at me and you like, we’re basically, you know, we should be competing over projects, but look at your podcast together. And I think that we push each…we level each other up. Because that’s what we’re supposed to do in this community. That’s the whole reason for small business is that we should support each other and make sure that the money is being funneled, throughout everyone. That’s really the best the biggest goal of mine.
Julia McDowell
What I love about the freelancing females group is everyone just shows up for each other. Yes, you know, like total strangers. But just, you know, if you help me, I help you, we all win. I just love. I love that. Yeah, it’s just like, you know, I got you, Sis, like we’re fam by now. Alright, so, last question. What would you say to your peers still working for an agency that may be considering should I go out on my own? What would you say to them? They’re like, I don’t know if I like this nine to five. Maybe I should, you know, work for myself. Or maybe they’re thinking I should become a freelancer? Like, what a great gig. Um, what would you say?
Eurah Lee
I think that if you’re thinking about it, then you have to do it. Because you’re just going to be thinking about it until you retire. Yeah, like, if it comes to mind, then it needs to be done. And I also know that it’s very hard for people to think about life without a paycheck. A lot of people can’t make that decision. And their setback for not going out on their own is that they might not have enough savings to hold on for the next few months. Or true, they need to make sure that their side businesses making X amount of money before they leave their nine to five, which is totally understandable. Like you have to look out for yourself because no one is going to look out for you. But just coming from my own experience that if the entrepreneur world is meant for you, those opportunities will come for you. Like just make the decision and everything else will follow. Everything else will follow. You just have to make the moves and consistently make moves. You can’t just sit around a desk and wait for clients to come for you know, it’s not gonna work like that. You have to at least put in a little bit of work, but it it will come and I think that we just have to end the end trust the world, that if it’s in our path, it will be there.
But I’m sure people are like ill you know, shut up. Like, what about money? If it’s meant for you, it’s going to come like when you make the decision, it will always be the right decision, you will never make a wrong decision. Totally.
Julia McDowell
I mean, when I left my last job, when I finally came to that decision, I, the day that I left or the day I said, I was going to leave, I really had no plan. I just trusted that something was going that I was going to make it happen once I closed that door, and then stepped in through another. And I was so lucky. Like, I have a background in sales and never truly wanted to do sales. But here I am, like the main sales person. And like when I like 45 days later, when I left to be on my own, I already had jobs lined up. I had been networking, I had been doing all the things. But I hadn’t necessarily thought about 45 days earlier. But like, I think your advice is spot on. And you believed in yourself. Yeah, I was just like, I’m gonna do it.
Eurah Lee
Mm hmm. You were like, I don’t know what’s next. But I believe in myself and I trust the world. So that’s all you have to do.
Julia McDowell
Just Yeah. And I didn’t sit at my desk just waiting for things. I went out and started making them happen. I just did things like organically–reached out to people that I knew, had conversations, started to think about all those things.
Eurah Lee
Yeah. And I also believe that sometimes you have to shed some things for your life to make room for more things. Like even in your home, like physically, but also mentally and like, you need to shed this nine to five or you need to shed this job that you don’t like in order for the new opportunities to come. Because right now, there’s no room for it.
Julia McDowell
Yeah, like the side hustle may never be bigger than it is. If you’ve always seen it’s a side hustle. Yeah. Because you’re ultimately focused on that on your job right now. So you want to make that side hustle, something to consider is, what is the potential of that? Once I can put 100% of my attention and focus and energy towards it? Yes. Agreed. Well, with that we’re gonna sign off but thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much.
Eurah Lee
Thank you for having me.
